F-414 Engine Production Costs in India Estimated Around $10 Million Per Unit Amid ToT Price Hike

India's ambitious Tejas Mk2 fighter jet program faces a potential cost increase as the price of the GE-414 engines, crucial for the aircraft's performance, is reportedly rising. This price adjustment stems from ongoing negotiations for the technology transfer (ToT) involved in manufacturing these engines domestically.

Despite the potential increase in ToT costs, sources suggest that the unit cost for each GE-414 engine produced in India is expected to be around $10 million. This estimate aligns with the baseline cost observed in the Korean KF-21 Boramae program, which utilizes similar engines.

The deal for 99 GE-414 engines is expected to be finalized by the end of March 2025, with local production commencing in 2028. While the exact unit cost remains under negotiation, projections indicate it will likely be slightly above the $10 million mark per engine. This reflects the advanced technology involved and the economies of scale anticipated from domestic production.

This cost escalation is not unique to India's defence acquisitions. Global defence deals are facing price adjustments due to various factors, including inflation, supply chain disruptions, and the evolving nature of technology transfer agreements.

However, for India, the increased cost is balanced by the strategic advantage of establishing indigenous manufacturing capabilities. This reduces long-term reliance on foreign suppliers and potentially lowers costs over time as production scales up.

The agreement with General Electric (GE) for the F-414 engines is vital for the Tejas Mk2 project, which aims to enhance the Indian Air Force's capabilities with advanced, domestically produced aircraft.

The GE-414 engine, renowned for its high performance and reliability, is expected to significantly boost the Tejas Mk2's capabilities, making it a formidable asset in modern aerial combat.

 

India lists theatre commands, simpler defence procurement as priorities for 2025 Ahead of AMCA Deployment, India's HLFT-42 Fighter Trainer to Integrate Advanced AI for Next-Generation Pilot Training

[PKPRS]

Whatever the cost is, we need this engine for now; we don't have an alternative.

 

[sanket]

After delays in GE-404 engine deliveries, this is the US's new way to milk money. All future fighter jet projects (Tejas MK2, TEDBF & AMCA MK1) depend on this GE-414 engine. Once the Kaveri engine & AMCA 110 kN thrust engine is developed, the GE engine will be kicked out. After the delay in the GE-404 engine deal, the GE-414 engine deal was not signed within the timeframe, even after receiving approval from US authorities. It has been deliberately unsigned, and now price escalation is being done. The US is known for business, nothing else. A similar thing happened with Rafale; after winning the MMRCA, the price was hiked, then even in the 36 Rafale deal. This is what western companies do after winning the deal by quoting the L1 bidder; when negotiation starts, they start milking money.

 

[Dipesh Debnath]

It is common knowledge. Making an engine is not just making an engine. You need an entire ecosystem and infrastructure for it. Training individuals and setting up new machinery is also part of the price. Increased price can be encountered, and it is necessary as no other company ever manufactured an engine for an aircraft before. Now we have AL-31FP for Su-30MKIs. It helped us gain some insight into engine manufacturing. Manufacturing some foreign machinery requires some money in the start but in turn gives you tons of experience in such a category. Like the cost of HAL making Su-30MKIs is more than Russian-made. But HAL, in turn, gets the expertise to make aircraft. In India, no private companies have come forward to lead aircraft programs because no private companies in India have the experience or record of manufacturing even a glider, forget an aircraft.

 

[Arin Kumar]

Price we pay for not developing comprehensive R&D facilities and manufacturing manpower.In 2015, Kaveri was sent to Russia for flight tests.In 2024, again Kaveri is being sent to Russia for flight tests.

What have we done in these 10 years?Why have we not been able to develop testing facilities in India in these 10 years?

 

[Bks98]

It is common knowledge. Making an engine is not just making an engine. You need an entire ecosystem and infrastructure for it. Training individuals and setting up new machinery is also part of the price. Increased price can be encountered, and it is necessary as no other company ever manufactured an engine for an aircraft before. Now we have AL-31FP for Su-30MKIs. It helped us gain some insight into engine manufacturing. Manufacturing some foreign machinery requires some money in the start but in turn gives you tons of experience in such a category. Like the cost of HAL making Su-30MKIs is more than Russian-made. But HAL, in turn, gets the expertise to make aircraft. In India, no private companies have come forward to lead aircraft programs because no private companies in India have the experience or record of manufacturing even a glider, forget an aircraft.

We Indian don't know how to do reverse engineering and make products like Chinese. Chinese took engines from Russia and did reverse engineering and created 10 to 15 variants of different capacity and now they are self sufficient. We must follow this model.

 

[Rational Guy]

Price we pay for not developing comprehensive R&D facilities and manufacturing manpower.In 2015, Kaveri was sent to Russia for flight tests.In 2024, again Kaveri is being sent to Russia for flight tests.

What have we done in these 10 years?Why have we not been able to develop testing facilities in India in these 10 years?

Actually Kaveri has gone extensive improvements since the last 10 years. Jet engines are extremely complex and take time to develop especially for a country like India which doesn't have a flying test bed yet.

 

[P.K.Chaudhuri]

USA has been successful in delaying LCA and Kaveri Engine programs in the past. Let us focus on self reliance.

 

[Chinese eater]

I have been writing for a long time that the GE engine deal will never materialize. This was exactly what the USA intended to do!! Coerce to win the tender, delay, arm-twisting, sanctions, sabotage similar products. India and the USA are not on the same page. The USA must have demanded India leave Russia completely.

 

[Leo red]

Why this people don't understand. Initial starting cost is always very high. Any one who do business understands that when u start new branch or new business cost is always very high. And we need engine without it fighters development is zero. No matter what's cost start making it in India. Also allow multiple companies to start if they want to business with india. And indigenous development also.

 

[Sandeep]

Actually Kaveri has gone extensive improvements since the last 10 years. Jet engines are extremely complex and take time to develop especially for a country like India which doesn't have a flying test bed yet.

Before we even get to test it on the flying test bed they need to first test it inside a simulated high altitude test facility and only when it passes that will they reach the stage where the engine is safe and reliable to use a test bed. You can’t just stick it on a plane as it could blow up.

 

[Sandeep]

We Indian don't know how to do reverse engineering and make products like Chinese. Chinese took engines from Russia and did reverse engineering and created 10 to 15 variants of different capacity and now they are self sufficient. We must follow this model.

India could have easily done the same thing but we followed and stuck to the terms and agreement in the contracts. Also the quality of their engines are worse than the Russian engines which gives them an unreliable performance.

 

[Rational Guy]

Before we even get to test it on the flying test bed they need to first test it inside a simulated high altitude test facility and only when it passes that will they reach the stage where the engine is safe and reliable to use a test bed. You can’t just stick it on a plane as it could blow up.

Obviously. We have simulated high altitude test bed do we have an actual FTB? We need FTB.

 

[Sandeep]

Developing and manufacturing a brand new, reliable, efficient, safe and cost effective engine will cost us money to start with. We are also going to receive 80% of the technology and starting up an entire new eco system with the correct machinery is always going to be expensive.

Also the advanced education, experience and knowledge we receive will help us to understand the science and engineering that is required and necessary to develop an engine. However, we also need to look at this deal as an essential strategic necessity to ensure national security. We can’t compromise on national security at all no matter the price.

 

[Sandeep]

Obviously. We have simulated high altitude test bed do we have an actual FTB? We need FTB.

To the best of my knowledge we have only just passed the simulated high altitude test facility and now we can test it on a flying test bed. So for the last 10+ years if we bought a flying test bed which are very expensive then that plane would be grounded and doing nothing. We would have spent millions on a plane that wouldn’t be flying or doing anything.

 

[Provocateur Extraordinaire]

India could have easily done the same thing but we followed and stuck to the terms and agreement in the contracts. Also the quality of their engines are worse than the Russian engines which gives them an unreliable performance.

Not the right approach. Infringing on IPR makes you untrustworthy in the eyes of the supplier who will hesitate to part with current tech products in the future preferring to sell you outdated products only or those which are not very advanced. Russia does that to China now. So unless you can reverse engineer and produce a superior product so that you don't need the supplier again in the future, it is best to play by the rules.

 

[GolGappa]

The US economy is in doldrums now. They will need to extract the maximum from the world for the next 2 decades to reduce their massive debt. So the US will sell India most of the tech (with long delays and arm-twisting), but the price will also be very high.

We have no option today, so try to bring the engine and at least complete the first batch of Indian jet fighters. Try to learn something from F-414 and apply it in Kaveri if possible.

 

[ramdas]

Relying solely on a single engine from the US has contributed to the current situation. It would be wise for the government to consider selecting an alternative engine as a backup option. This could help ensure greater stability and reliability in the event of reliance on a single vendor.

 

[Shiva]

So, over all, dealing with GE made entire deal as a BIG ELEPHANT.
Neither you can ignore, nor you get fruits.
I think, Indian parliament should pass a bill, to ban GE for next 30 years and there will be no import of any product , if it contains any GE product, as GE is involved in intentional delays and will be declared as unreliable company for strategic deals of national importance.

Parliament has to keep additional clause, saying any other engine including AL-FP engine, should be avoided to purchase, if it restricts on volume of purchase or restrictions on its enhancements.
and show confident on Indian R&D Departments for solutions.

Also, has to pass a separate fund exclusively for engine developments of all kinds for bulk production. High level products will be designed before engine production, but metal cutting of any product will start only after abundant number of engines, at least 500 are already made.
Preference should be given only to those products, in which engine is bulk produceable.

Any 5th or 6th Gen aircraft can be defeated with three or four 4.5 Gen aircrafts if suitable algorithm is developed. Since India is very good in algorithm development, India should focus on bulk development rather than specialized products of little volume.

 

[Bharat]

Before we even get to test it on the flying test bed they need to first test it inside a simulated high altitude test facility and only when it passes that will they reach the stage where the engine is safe and reliable to use a test bed. You can’t just stick it on a plane as it could blow up.

Before the flying test bed, you need to first develop the right materials. It is not something that can be bought from a local hardware store. The materials development requires years of research. I don’t think we have deep fighter jet related Materials Science expertise yet despite having an excellent space program

 

[beencensured]

Not the right approach. Infringing on IPR makes you untrustworthy in the eyes of the supplier who will hesitate to part with current tech products in the future preferring to sell you outdated products only or those which are not very advanced. Russia does that to China now. So unless you can reverse engineer and produce a superior product so that you don't need the supplier again in the future, it is best to play by the rules.

What current technology?

 

[MSN]

From the beginning, it was a no-deal situation since the US did not want to sell such engines to us. This move was made by the US simply to distract attention and stall Indian progress toward indigenisation.
The only option for GoI now is to give DRDO an ultimatum for Kaveri engines and start reverse engineering on received FE404 engines to develop new engines quickly.

 

[rsingh]

The Americans are notorious for violation of sanctity of contract. I had warned the GOI ahead of and during PM Modi's visit to US last year in June on this issue. I also cautioned them that US Govt does not transfer technology or allow it's companies to transfer unless it is dated technology. With great regret it must be said that we just don't have the technological infrastructure or manpower (those who are qualified proudly work for US companies and they pooh pooh our high tech industry). May please see these two articles I wrote in 2023 for TheWire.
Please see the portion 'India's concern'

US-India Strategic Convergence: A Bridge Too Far?

Directly or indirectly, the issue of human rights is sure to come up again during Modi’s visit. It is what PM Modi conveys in his address to the US Congress that will indicate what his government’s priorities are.

m.thewire.in

May also like to see the portion on strategic and defence ties in this subsequent article

Modi’s US Visit: Beyond Optics, the Substance is Not Much to Crow About

What is driving Biden’s courting of India now is not something that will bear fruit in 5-10 years, which is the time frame for items listed so grandiosely in the joint statement.

m.thewire.in

 

[kumar]

All the more reason to invest in high altitude test facility and FTB. This has been the bane where we refuse to invest in test facilities but want quick result from projects.

 

[netram]

Squeezing us to the bone

 

[Baiju Bhaskaran]

It will be our biggest stupidity to base Tejas MK2 on GE 414 after all the drama happened on Tejas MK1A. MK2 is still in the design stage. We can still readjust MK2 to operate on AL31 or Safran.

 

[Varaaah]

Developing and manufacturing a brand new, reliable, efficient, safe and cost effective engine will cost us money to start with. We are also going to receive 80% of the technology and starting up an entire new eco system with the correct machinery is always going to be expensive.

Also the advanced education, experience and knowledge we receive will help us to understand the science and engineering that is required and necessary to develop an engine. However, we also need to look at this deal as an essential strategic necessity to ensure national security. We can’t compromise on national security at all no matter the price.

There are other players too. Besides, the Kaveri, with lesser power, has given insight in how to develop such engine. But the problem is the lack of will. Just when Kaveri was on a break through, someone decided to kill the funds and stall it. To create dependence on foreigners.
There is no shortage of desh drohis in Bhaarat.

 

[Dragon]

Previous govts never even thought of atmanirbharta. Instead they killed every scope that India had by not continuing the legacy of Maruti and that bomber that they made. So I have no hope from them. All hope I had was from this govt and while it has delivered in navy and army, it has continuously failed in airforce delivery and continues to disappoint. If this is the most competent party we have then I don't see any future for our defence industry.

 

[Provocateur Extraordinaire]

What current technology?

Let me explain the denial of current tech by way of an example. Russia sold s 400 to China because s 500 was already in the pipeline. While they have already sent s 500 feelers to India, they won't do the same to china unless s 600 or whatever they choose to call it is already under progress significantly. Because they know how china infringed on IPR of su-27 to produce their clones.

 

[Rinku Pandey]

GE414 is the best engine India can get and for such an advanced product with TOT we should be willing to pay the escalated costs. Our mk2 and AMCA are dependent on GE414 engines till the time new 5th generation engine is made with Safran, RR or GE which will take another 10 years if we sign the deal today.