How HAL's Nashik Plant only Needs 20-30% New Tooling for Su-57E 5th-Gen Fighter Production, Leveraging Existing SU-30MKI Lines

Producing Russia's advanced Su-57E stealth fighter jet at Hindustan Aeronautics Limited's (HAL) Nashik facility could require remarkably little new investment, according to a senior official from Rostec, Russia's state-owned defence and technology corporation.

The official stated that the existing infrastructure used for manufacturing Su-30MKI aircraft means only 20-30% new tooling would be necessary to adapt the plant for the fifth-generation fighter.

This potential efficiency stems largely from the extensive experience and equipment already present at the HAL Nashik plant. For the past two decades, this facility has been central to India's air power, manufacturing nearly 200 Su-30MKI multirole fighters under a licensed production agreement with Russia's Sukhoi Design Bureau (now part of Rostec's United Aircraft Corporation).

This long-term project has equipped the plant with specialised ground machinery, assembly jigs, support equipment, and a workforce skilled in complex fighter jet production.

The Rostec representative explained that while the Su-57E, the export version of Russia's premier stealth fighter, features cutting-edge technologies like advanced avionics, composite materials, and a low-observable airframe design, its fundamental assembly methods and manufacturing workflows are quite similar to those of the Su-30MKI.

Consequently, much of the tooling and infrastructure from the Su-30MKI line is reusable. The estimated 20-30% of new tooling would primarily be for elements specific to the Su-57E, such as its unique airframe shape and sophisticated internal systems.

A major advantage highlighted by the Russian official is the potential for significant cost reductions if India opts for local manufacturing. "If India decides to locally manufacture them (Su-57), then it will cut down procurement costs as the money required for their manufacturing locally will be minimum, thus resulting in lower unit cost," the official noted. Refurbishing the existing Nashik line would be considerably less expensive than building a new facility from scratch.

Further savings could be achieved through bulk negotiation leverage for materials and subsystems, the elimination of import taxes, and reduced transportation costs compared to buying fully assembled aircraft.

Moreover, the experienced HAL Nashik workforce, already proficient from years of assembling the Su-30MKI, would require less training, allowing for a quicker transition to producing the Su-57E.

Although the precise cost per aircraft is not public, analysts suggest local production could lower the unit price by 20-30%, potentially making the advanced fighter a more economically feasible option for the Indian Air Force (IAF).

From an operational standpoint, acquiring the Su-57E could substantially boost the IAF's capabilities. Its stealth characteristics are designed to allow penetration of sophisticated enemy air defence systems.

Additionally, its ability to fly at supersonic speeds for extended periods without using fuel-guzzling afterburners (supercruise) offers a tactical advantage in range and response time.

The aircraft is also designed to carry a diverse array of weapons, including advanced air-to-air and air-to-ground munitions, and potentially hypersonic missiles, making it a potent platform for various mission types in future combat scenarios.

This proposal underscores the long-standing India-Russia defence partnership and its potential role in India's ongoing military modernization efforts.

 

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[Akshat]

India is not the UK and Italy; they are NATO countries; India is not.

Remember, eight Apache attack helicopters have not been delivered yet, ordered five years ago, and MH-60 Romeo is also completely delivered.

Trusting the USA will make IAF life suffer.

Remember the blackmailing in Vikramaditya? Remember the delays in Su30 MKI? S400? Backstabbing in Ka226T? So Russia is far more unreliable.

Then comes our HAL, surpassing everyone else. 40 Tejas ordered since 2010 haven't been delivered yet (at least as of December 2024).

So US is far more reliable than our other options (with the likely exception of Israel and France, wherever applicable).

 

[Bks98]

Technology transfer of SU-30 to HAL happened and today HAL has no capability to make SU-30 and is buying from Russia, whereas China has already made several variants of Russian fighter jets and is selling them as J-series. Now Russia has full confidence in HAL that despite 100% technology transfer of SU-57, they will still rely on Russia.

 

[Akshat]

US hasn't given TOT to any of its NATO state, they will give to India and KC-135 is not an offensive weapon and technology. Most advanced systems like these can be offered to India easily. Talk about any advanced technology weapons which US offers.

Israel is not a NATO member, but it's most important non-NATO ally and they buy all weapons from USA only unlike India. Also, Israel doesn't act independently, they only get special permission from the Pentagon under the watch of US only.

F404 is far more advanced than what we can make. P8I are the most advanced sub hunters in the world. Pinnacle of naval technology. Apaches are the pinnacle of rotorcrafts. Chinooks. M777 artillery. In fighter jets, their entire range of 4th gen planes are on offer for 2 decades (and we have asked for 4th gen only, so don't bring in F35).

 

[Akshat]

But Jaguar is happening.

Are we buying any new Jaguars?

 

[Akshat]

Now, IAF won't purchase since it's cheap.

Now, if Russians are attacked by, say, China, will Russians rush to buy American F35 or will Russians lose the battle with China?

This is my point. Every aircraft is good enough versus the current Chinese fleet. Therefore, Su-57 is a good choice where you can negotiate engine indigenisation to, say, 90 percent.

Haha...Russians refuse to give even 35% of ToT for Ka226T. That's a helicopter that is over 2 decades old, and Russian military has refused to buy it. Yet Russia refuses to give even 35% ToT. And you say 90% for Su57 is negotiable? Funny.

Now coming to Chinese fleet. Remember, Russia offered Su57 to China, but China evaluated it and refused to buy it, saying that J20 is far superior. Now, you can say, 'Oh so you wanna trust China?'. But remember, if they are letting go of an opportunity to buy a few Su57 for even reverse engineering, it shows that the plane is actually complete junk. Else China would have bought a few units.

 

[kumar]

Without latest engine, this is not going to work.

 

[Anonymus]

Then how did India sign the lease for the KC135 Stratotanker if they did not trust the US?And also, Israel is not a NATO member, but it can use its F-35 customized and independently.

Even if India tries to negotiate, the US can offer F-35 ToT to India in the same way it reduced tariffs on India on April 2.

US hasn't given TOT to any of its NATO state, they will give to India and KC-135 is not an offensive weapon and technology. Most advanced systems like these can be offered to India easily. Talk about any advanced technology weapons which US offers.

Israel is not a NATO member, but it's most important non-NATO ally and they buy all weapons from USA only unlike India. Also, Israel doesn't act independently, they only get special permission from the Pentagon under the watch of US only.

 

[Anonymus]

Are we buying any new Jaguars?

No, but they are crashing, costing pilot lives. We require new jets.

 

[Sandeep]

India will not consider this jet while they are still developing it. There’s still a lot of technology and equipment that they still need to develop and install like their stealth engine, concealed IRST etc.

Currently they are manufacturing the AMCA prototype which means most of the technology has been designed and developed and all they need to do is manufacture it now. We should focus more on manufacturing the jet very quickly and getting the private sector better prepared for the upcoming orders.

 

[Akshat]

No, but they are crashing, costing pilot lives. We require new jets.

Yes, but that doesn't mean it has to be Russian. We have far better options.

 

[Anonymus]

Yes, but that doesn't mean it has to be Russian. We have far better options.

Better options which ones?

 

[Akshat]

Better options which ones?

Well IAF decided to ditch FGFA and go ahead with MRFA. So the planes on offer in MRFA are better, as per IAF. In fact, Russia itself cancelled Su57 orders, and went ahead with Su35 (this was before the war and sanctions). So there are many many better options. EF Typhoon and Rafale being at the top.

 

[Anonymus]

Well IAF decided to ditch FGFA and go ahead with MRFA. So the planes on offer in MRFA are better, as per IAF. In fact, Russia itself cancelled Su57 orders, and went ahead with Su35 (this was before the war and sanctions). So there are many many better options. EF Typhoon and Rafale being at the top.

Typhoons and Rafales are too costly to procure considering 4th gen jets spending 270 million on 4th jets is wastage of money and won't give any edge over chinese.

 

[Akshat]

Typhoons and Rafales are too costly to procure considering 4th gen jets spending 270 million on 4th jets is wastage of money and won't give any edge over chinese.

Well whatever they are, they are the cheapest option among the planes meeting our requirements. And they will surely give a far bigger edge over the Chinese then the Russian jets can, including Su57. Certified by IAF.

 

[Raja Rajan]

Should Russia give a total tech transfer, including that of the engines, India has everything to gain with the SU-57 local production. India will also be able to maximize the site and manpower utilization once the Su-30MKI is not produced locally, except for maintenance and refitting. While the SU-57 with the engines is ready for production, the new proposed technology cooperation to produce a new engine is too far away, provided the foreign partners do not meet restrictions from their government in the percentage of technology transfer.

 

[obiwankenubi jedi]

Then why don't we verify and do this with due diligence. Su-30MKI has proven its worth.

Su-75, AMCA are under development.

F-35 is widely used but with restrictions in usage, no local manufacturing and with monitoring.

Other options are off the table, KF-21, J-35/J-20 or

then why not Su-57 without restrictions and with local manufacturing

until AMCA comes up in numbers and by the time Su-30 MKI is decommissioned which is like the next 10-20 years really.

 

[Surendra Barsode]

While the Russian offer is tempting, let us be clear that we should forget the MRFA tender and kill all such talks. Just focus on Tejas II and AMCA. Maybe we can move to super Tejas as well.

 

[Butcherkill]

F404 is far more advanced than what we can make. P8I are the most advanced sub hunters in the world. Pinnacle of naval technology. Apaches are the pinnacle of rotorcrafts. Chinooks. M777 artillery. In fighter jets, their entire range of 4th gen planes are on offer for 2 decades (and we have asked for 4th gen only, so don't bring in F35).

Lol, too much of pride and hypocrite is not good for yourself. By the way, nowadays War are mostly relay on the modern suicide drones and EW suite. Even the amazing facts is that Russia still surviving from the sanction and able to creates some pretty crazy stuff, that even china, US and Europe can't make it.

 

[Avada kedavra]

Remember the blackmailing in Vikramaditya? Remember the delays in Su30 MKI? S400? Backstabbing in Ka226T? So Russia is far more unreliable.

Then comes our HAL, surpassing everyone else. 40 Tejas ordered since 2010 haven't been delivered yet (at least as of December 2024).

So US is far more reliable than our other options (with the likely exception of Israel and France, wherever applicable).

Now you really have lost it.

I still remember reading a report of how Boeing did not honour the offset obligation of the creation of a test bed facility.

I think even Lockheed Martin also did it.

The Americans also refused to send satellite data during the Kargil war.

Christine Fair, the famed Pakistan critic, also revealed once that she gave all the evidence and guidance on how to take down anti-India terror groups like LeT & JeM to American officials, but they did not take them seriously, even though they themselves declared it a terror group.

Then Ukraine is the best example now. The US under Trump pulled back support.

Zelensky himself complained that a large amount of aid is yet to come.

Then if you ask the Pakistanis themselves, they will also give a long list of betrayals, like the Pressler Amendment and others.

Also, don't forget how Nixon pulled support for the South Vietnamese government at the last moment, which led to their ultimate defeat to the communists.

They also bypassed the pro-West Ashraf Ghani Afghan government and made a direct deal with the Taliban. This led to a loss of morale in the Afghan army and eventual defeat under the Taliban government.

The British, their most loyal ally, complain to this day of how, after finishing a large part of the Manhattan Project, the Americans ended all cooperation in the field of nuclear research and forced them to start their own nuclear program.

After getting kicked out of the F-35 program, the Turks were promised F-16s as compensation for all the money Turkey invested in the F-35 program, but even that was put on hold for some other reasons.

There are many more examples which I can't recall right now.

 

[Butcherkill]

It is a nice offer, but F-35 is more advanced and proven than Su-57. If India just gets it to negotiate with the Pentagon for ToT and somehow integrate it with Su-30, then it's done. F-35 will integrate by itself into the rest of the systems. If India spends $100 billion on these, even China would fear attacking us, because it needs to face the world's most advanced fighter jet.

F-35 is not that special that you think, it's a foolproof scam. If you want combat operations to strike the enemy base and air assets, for that you need to take off 6 F-35s, whereas you can send 3 Su-57s, which can carry twice the payloads and weapons than the 6 F-35s compared to 3 Su-57s for stealth operations. So it's definitely a scam or a fool who can buy more F-35s to show off its arsenal and waste money.

 

[Anonymus]

Well whatever they are, they are the cheapest option among the planes meeting our requirements. And they will surely give a far bigger edge over the Chinese then the Russian jets can, including Su57. Certified by IAF.

really what kind of edge 4th gen jets will give over 5th gen jets and also consider j36 and j50 6th gen 1 each of there prototypes have been there already.

 

[Mango_Indian]

Totally wrong! A HAL assembled Su-30 MKI used to cost INR 85 crores more than a fully imported Russian Su-30MKI (415 crores vs 330 crores) way back in 2018 (link below). The reason - HAL adds 30% to the price charged by the original manufacturer/HAL/Indian private company. To the cost and profit charged by each of the firms with the Su-30MKI production modules, HAL adds 30%. So the price escalates. Basically, 60% of the components (high tech) are made in Russia, imported by HAL, costed up by 30% and charged to GoI. The rest 40% are fabricated in India by HAL/private entities and again, costed up by 30%.

Google "Why the Tejas cost is high" - excerpt below.

A recent Indian Express story (June 27) on the topic revealed that HAL charges Rs 463 crore for the Tejas Mk-1A versus Rs 363 crore for the original LCA, and Rs 415 crore for the Su-30MKI built at Nashik (compared to Rs 330 crore if sourced from Russia).

 

[Akshat]

really what kind of edge 4th gen jets will give over 5th gen jets and also consider j36 and j50 6th gen 1 each of there prototypes have been there already.

Again, whatever they are, they are surely better than Su57. That's why IAF refused FGFA and went for MRFA, and Russia refused Su57 and went for Su35. Su57 is the ultimate junk.

 

[Anonymus]

Again, whatever they are, they are surely better than Su57. That's why IAF refused FGFA and went for MRFA, and Russia refused Su57 and went for Su35. Su57 is the ultimate junk.

IAF refused FGFA because Russia wasn't willing to supply critical components and techs to India. That's why India backed off. It wasn't because of MRFA (MMRCA); it was different from FGFA.

 

[Akshat]

IAF refused FGFA because Russia wasn't willing to supply critical components and techs to India. That's why India backed off. It wasn't because of MRFA (MMRCA); it was different from FGFA.

Our ex-CDS is on record that India will buy the plane if and when it meets the requirements of IAF. So it wasn't about transferring any tech. India is willing to buy it even off the shelf. It was because the plane wasn't meeting our qualitative requirements. But MRFA is. So MRFA is more advanced than FGFA, as per IAF.

 

[Surfer]

Then how did India sign the lease for the KC135 Stratotanker if they did not trust the US?And also, Israel is not a NATO member, but it can use its F-35 customized and independently.

Even if India tries to negotiate, the US can offer F-35 ToT to India in the same way it reduced tariffs on India on April 2.

KC-135 is not bought from the US, we leased it from a private company named Metrea that bought 13 retired French KC-135’s that are more than 60 year’s old and started the leasing Business.