Russian Test Pilot Predicts Su-57 Could Outmaneuver F-35 in Close-Range Dogfight, Citing Superior Thrust Vectoring and EW Systems

Russian Test Pilot Predicts Su-57 Could Outmaneuver F-35 in Close-Range Dogfight, Citing Superior Thrust Vectoring and EW Systems


The upcoming Aero India 2025 in Bengaluru is generating significant buzz as it will feature both the Russian Su-57 Felon and the American F-35 Lightning II, two of the world's most advanced fifth-generation fighter jets.

Adding to the excitement, Sergey Bogdan, a decorated Russian test pilot and Hero of Russia, has offered his expert opinion on a hypothetical dogfight between these formidable aircraft.

Bogdan highlighted the Su-57's exceptional maneuverability, attributing it to the aircraft's advanced thrust vectoring capabilities. This technology allows the Su-57 to perform complex aerial maneuvers, giving it a potential advantage in a close-range dogfight against the F-35, which is primarily designed as a strike fighter with a greater emphasis on stealth and beyond-visual-range combat.

While acknowledging the F-35's stealth capabilities, Bogdan asserted that the Su-57 possesses its own suite of stealth technologies and advanced sensors, ensuring its competitiveness. He emphasized that in a real-world combat scenario, the ability to detect and engage the enemy first is crucial, and the Su-57's radar and electronic warfare systems are designed to provide this advantage.

The Su-57's internal weapons bay can accommodate a variety of missiles for both long-range and close-combat engagements, offering flexibility in combat scenarios. Bogdan suggested that the ability to select the appropriate weapon at the right moment could be a decisive factor in a simulated battle.

Furthermore, Bogdan praised the Su-57's advanced cockpit systems, which provide pilots with enhanced situational awareness, potentially enabling faster decision-making during aerial combat.

According to Bogdan, a hypothetical duel between the two jets would likely begin with a long-range engagement, where both aircraft would utilize their stealth capabilities and sensors to locate each other.

The F-35's advanced data fusion capabilities would make it a challenging adversary, but the Su-57's agility and defensive systems could allow it to evade initial attacks.

As the engagement transitions to a closer range, the Su-57's superior maneuverability might give it the upper hand in a visual dogfight, where traditional dogfighting skills become more critical.

With both the Su-57 and F-35 slated to perform at Aero India 2025, spectators and analysts are eager to witness their capabilities firsthand. Bogdan's insights add another layer of intrigue to the event, highlighting the interplay of technology, strategy, and pilot skill in modern aerial warfare.

This year's Aero India is shaping up to be one of the most anticipated airshows, offering a glimpse into the future of air combat.
 
Good to know. Finally, the US will show a demonstration. Earlier it was said the F-35 will have a static display. The Su-57 already showed its takeoff in a few seconds.
 
The way he is emphasizing its maneuverability and its advantage in WVR case and dogfights tells a picture about its stealth characteristics. If you read between the lines, it's obvious that it's not much better than current leading 4.5 gen jets like EFT and Rafale.
 
The way he is emphasizing its maneuverability and its advantage in WVR case and dogfights tells a picture about its stealth characteristics. If you read between the lines, it's obvious that it's not much better than current leading 4.5 gen jets like EFT and Rafale.
Typical Russians who live in the past with dogfighting tactics. They never got the stealth on SU-57 properly. It's more of a pseudo 5th gen.
 
Typical Russians who live in the past with dogfighting tactics. They never got the stealth on SU-57 properly. It's more of a pseudo 5th gen.
It's is not supposed to be stealth according to their doctrine, lot of people get this wrong, their real stealth jet is MIG-41 which is a 6th gen jet that is under development, SU-57 is just a bridge that fills both 4.5 and 5th.
 
We should get SU-57 with AL-41 initially and later with AL-51 as quickly as possible without Russian radar but our own Uttam AESA radar and indigenous avionics and upgrade Su-30 into Super Sukhoi by MRO or private players such as Tata etc. of IAF, not by HAL. Similarly, we can order the F-35 with our radar and avionics without worry about the system-of-systems feature, which is anyway not going to be helpful with compatibility or refueling with our existing infrastructure.
 
It's is not supposed to be stealth according to their doctrine, lot of people get this wrong, their real stealth jet is MIG-41 which is a 6th gen jet that is under development, SU-57 is just a bridge that fills both 4.5 and 5th.
Su-57 is relevant to fight our adversaries presently and 1 to 1.5 decades ahead. By that time, our indigenous engines will hopefully be ready and our designers can develop a 7th-gen fighter.
 
Lol in other words
IF the SU-57 can avoid the barrage of Missiles, because it will be seen first, and they won't know they're being attacked until the missiles are on top of them.
and
IF it can close the distance

Then it MIGHT have a chance WVR

THATS a mighty big "IF"
 
It's is not supposed to be stealth according to their doctrine, lot of people get this wrong, their real stealth jet is MIG-41 which is a 6th gen jet that is under development, SU-57 is just a bridge that fills both 4.5 and 5th.
Really? Because they talked all about how stealthy it was before. Now the tunes changed?
 
Lol in other words
IF the SU-57 can avoid the barrage of Missiles, because it will be seen first, and they won't know they're being attacked until the missiles are on top of them.
and
IF it can close the distance

Then it MIGHT have a chance WVR

THATS a mighty big "IF"
Basically yes. Except that radar missiles are not stealthy and would be detected the moment they start tracking, giving Su-57 time to react. But whether that would be useful at all is questionable.
 
Su-57 is relevant to fight our adversaries presently and 1 to 1.5 decades ahead. By that time, our indigenous engines will hopefully be ready and our designers can develop a 7th-gen fighter.
It is better than any 4.5 jets available today and might be better than the Chinese 5th gen jets at least.
 
Really? Because they talked all about how stealthy it was before. Now the tunes changed?
They always said it has frontal stealth, they never paid any attention to rear stealth even in the design, they could have if they wanted to.
 
Lol in other words
IF the SU-57 can avoid the barrage of Missiles, because it will be seen first, and they won't know they're being attacked until the missiles are on top of them.
and
IF it can close the distance

Then it MIGHT have a chance WVR

THATS a mighty big "IF"
SU-57 works in conjunction with Triumf and Prometheus that have a range of 400 and 600km respectively. Their R-37 BVR missile's range is 400km. There is no other BVR missile with a range that is more than 400km currently. To fire a BVR from that far won't be accurate, so SU-57 has very good coverage on its back to escape until the stealth jets come closer. Once they are within sight, then SU-57m is the king in super maneuverability and dogfight with its stellar agility. So at the moment and with the current available technology, stealth jets wouldn't make much difference compared to 4.5 gen jets until some country invents a BVR missile with a range exceeding 1000km and is pinpoint accurate. At this distance, OTH radars can easily track a stealth jet, but engaging is a different story.

There is a study that says "BVR missiles had a kill rate of only 34%. By contrast, WVR missiles had a kill rate of 67%, despite costing less than half of a BVR missile". If that is the case stealth jets are only marginally effective and useful in the current era. It is not worth the upfront and operational cost. Russians understood this.
 
Typical Russians who live in the past with dogfighting tactics. They never got the stealth on SU-57 properly. It's more of a pseudo 5th gen.
Not at all. The jet there is a T-50. The Su-57M was made for high stealth capability so it can get closer where it does have huge advantages. It's also strong in long range.
 
It's is not supposed to be stealth according to their doctrine, lot of people get this wrong, their real stealth jet is MIG-41 which is a 6th gen jet that is under development, SU-57 is just a bridge that fills both 4.5 and 5th.
Not true. Su-57M is designed for high stealth to get closer to the enemy where it does have advantages over F-22 and F-35. Also, the jet is strong in long range thanks to the 400km R-37M and there is a T-50 prototype.
 
The days of having dog fights are over decades ago. Now it’s about seeing the enemy first and shooting first with BVR missiles.
 
The way he is emphasizing its maneuverability and its advantage in WVR case and dogfights tells a picture about its stealth characteristics. If you read between the lines, it's obvious that it's not much better than current leading 4.5 gen jets like EFT and Rafale.
Manuverability also works agaonst A2A or G2A (AAD) missiles and WVR still can be ~30-40km - dont be so shortsighted
 

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