US F-35 Proposal for India Faces Headwinds as IAF Signals Preference for More Rafale Jets and Indigenous AMCA

US F-35 Proposal for India Faces Headwinds as IAF Signals Preference for More Rafale Jets and Indigenous AMCA


A potential offer from the United States to supply India with the advanced F-35A Lightning II stealth fighter jet, first announced by U.S. President Donald Trump in February, appears to be facing significant challenges.

Nearly three months after the high-profile suggestion aimed at strengthening U.S.-India defence ties, no formal proposal has been submitted. Meanwhile, indications suggest the Indian Air Force (IAF) is prioritising the acquisition of additional French-made Dassault Rafale jets and focusing on its indigenous Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA) program.

During a meeting with Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi in Washington D.C. on February 13, President Trump indicated a substantial increase in military sales to India, specifically mentioning "paving the way" for the F-35A.

This fifth-generation fighter, known for its stealth capabilities, advanced sensors, and multi-role functions, is operated by key U.S. allies. Its acquisition could significantly enhance the IAF's capabilities, especially considering regional air power developments.

However, the discussion remains informal. Indian Foreign Secretary Vikram Misri previously stated that no official procurement process is underway, which would typically require a formal Request for Proposals (RFP) and detailed evaluations.

The lack of a concrete government-to-government framework or timeline raises questions about the offer's feasibility.

Further complicating matters are the F-35A's significant costs – estimated at around $82.5 million per aircraft plus substantial operational expenses – and the stringent end-user conditions typically imposed by the U.S. on its advanced defence technology.

While the F-35 discussion remains uncertain, the IAF seems to be moving forward with plans to expand its fleet of Rafale fighters. India currently operates 36 Rafales, acquired in a deal finalised in 2016, and the air force has reportedly expressed satisfaction with their performance.

Recent developments suggest the IAF is keen on acquiring 114 additional Rafales under the ongoing Multi-Role Fighter Aircraft (MRFA) procurement program.

The preference for the Rafale stems from several factors. It is a proven 4.5-generation aircraft already integrated into the IAF, featuring India-specific enhancements and compatibility with existing infrastructure, unlike the F-35 which would require major logistical and training adjustments.

Furthermore, the Rafale is seen as having lower lifecycle costs compared to the F-35. France's established track record of technology transfer and willingness to support local manufacturing aligns well with India's 'Make in India' defence production goals, a contrast to potential U.S. restrictions on sensitive F-35 technology.

The IAF also faces pressure to address its declining number of fighter squadrons, currently standing at 31 against a required strength of 42, as older aircraft like the MiG-21 are phased out. Procuring additional Rafales offers a faster way to bolster squadron strength compared to the lengthy process and integration hurdles anticipated with the F-35.

Beyond immediate needs, the focus on Rafale aligns with India's long-term strategic goal of self-reliance in defence, embodied by the indigenous AMCA program. This fifth-generation stealth fighter project, managed by the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) and Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL), aims for a first flight around 2028 and induction by 2034.

Having received significant government backing, including ₹15,000 crore in initial funding, the AMCA represents India's ambition to develop its own advanced combat aircraft tailored to its specific requirements.

Defence analysts and officials suggest that pursuing the F-35 could potentially divert critical resources and focus away from the strategically vital AMCA project. A senior official previously noted that opting for a U.S. fighter could represent a setback for India's indigenous defence efforts.

In this context, acquiring more Rafales is viewed as a practical interim measure to maintain capability while the AMCA program matures, fitting better with the national vision of 'Atmanirbhar Bharat' (Self-Reliant India).

Ultimately, several significant hurdles hinder a potential F-35 deal for India. These include the aircraft's high acquisition and operational costs, major challenges in integrating it with India's existing Russian-origin platforms (like the S-400 defence system and Su-30MKI fighters), potential geopolitical friction with traditional defence partners like Russia, strict U.S. end-user restrictions, and the overriding national priority placed on indigenous programs like the AMCA and the Tejas Mk2 fighter.

Given these factors, the IAF's apparent lean towards procuring more Rafales under the MRFA initiative – potentially becoming the last major foreign fighter acquisition – seems increasingly likely. This approach allows India to meet its medium-term defence needs while concentrating resources on the indigenous AMCA to anchor its future air combat capabilities, reducing long-term dependence on foreign suppliers.

The F-35A, despite its technological prowess, appears misaligned with India's current strategic trajectory and commitment to defence indigenisation.
 
Pro Russia group in Bureaucracy is denying Cutting edge fighter jet acquisition, F-35 is better than costly 4.5 gen Rafale or we should go for both ! F-35 acquisition can pave way for NGAD/F-47 and B-21s just one thing is to be resolved that is carrot and stick approach by USA !
 
Buying fighter jet under MRFA, and choosing foreign engine partner for AMCA will decide the impact on future indigenous fighter jet projects.

If RR is selected as a partner for the engine, then Dassault has to meet Make in India parameters plus autonomy of integration of indigenous as well as third-party sensors and weapons systems on the French fighter jet Rafale with not only the fighter jet ecosystem but also the engine ecosystem too.

If Dassault wants to win MRFA, then with the engine/fighter jet ecosystem and autonomy of integration of weapons sensors, they can do it by starting local assembly with local private players involving. The purpose of MRFA is involving local private players in integrating fighter jets locally.

So now it will depend on Dassault who is unwilling to share ToT as well as wants 100% stake in DRAL.

Lastly, it doesn't mean 26 additional Rafales are bought means Rafale will automatically win the MRFA, still it has to go through the MRFA process. And in MRFA, anything can happen, and in the naval 26 Rafale, it was a limited choice, but for the Airforce version, the sky is the limit.
 
Why even compare a 4th gen fighter with F35 and SU-57, let’s see what this Rafale G2G rumor does, spending $40Bln on a 4th gen platform when even a bankrupt country wanted to induct 5th and 6th gen Aircraft in the next five years is criminal beyond apprehension.
 
Why even compare a 4th gen fighter with F35 and SU-57, let’s see what this Rafale G2G rumor does, spending $40Bln on a 4th gen platform when even a bankrupt country wanted to induct 5th and 6th gen Aircraft in the next five years is criminal beyond apprehension.
Not criminal. This is realism. Rafale is always the L1. So it is the cheapest plane on offer. Remember, Rafale defeated even F-18 on cost. So just imagine what the real cost of F-35 will be. And we will still get no ToT or integration of Indian weapons. So Rafale is the most advanced platform which we can buy right now. It also accepts the fact that Tejas Mk2 isn't coming anytime soon.
 
Not criminal. This is realism. Rafale is always the L1. So it is the cheapest plane on offer. Remember, Rafale defeated even F-18 on cost. So just imagine what the real cost of F-35 will be. And we will still get no ToT or integration of Indian weapons. So Rafale is the most advanced platform which we can buy right now. It also accepts the fact that Tejas Mk2 isn't coming anytime soon.
But it is 6th-gen era now, we don’t want to go for a 30-year-old vintage tech.
 
MRFA deal only in 2027? That means the first jet may reach 2032-33 only. PAF may induct the J-35 fifth-gen jet in 2030. God will save the IAF.
 
Why even compare a 4th gen fighter with F35 and SU-57, let’s see what this Rafale G2G rumor does, spending $40Bln on a 4th gen platform when even a bankrupt country wanted to induct 5th and 6th gen Aircraft in the next five years is criminal beyond apprehension.
Further, when MoD reduces SSN order by 4 units (worth 80k crore) and cancels aircraft carrier plans (worth 30-40k crore), how can they afford 110-114 Rafales (worth ~270k crore)?
 
Stop wasting Tax payers money in a 4th gen Jet who's complete induction(114 no.) would go beyond 2045.
Better buy a 5th Gen Jet with that money which can serve beyond 2070 as Rafales will get obsolete beyond 2050 with advanced 6th Gen jets.
 
US is funding Bangladesh against India. Pumping proxies against all countries. And keep on changing conditions. What happens if we purchase and then if US comes with a condition of 100% tariff on all weapons to India? What about the delivery of engines for Tejas? Apache delivery is pending after 7 years. And what about the navy helicopters order which is still not delivered after 5 years? Ohhh, sorry, we can also have delivery of f35 with a delay of 50 years.
 
Further, when MoD reduces SSN order by 4 units (worth 80k crore) and cancels aircraft carrier plans (worth 30-40k crore), how can they afford 110-114 Rafales (worth ~270k crore)?
Um, not going to comment in the Rafales. However, your point about the SSNs and the carrier isn't entirely correct. Hear me out here.

Looking at how the Arihant-class was built, it was expected by many that the SSN program would be split into 3+3 or something similar, with boats being built in two batches. As things stand, that is the plan, with the first batch planned to have 2 ships, with a further 4 following in the second batch. Heck, we might end up having an upgraded class or a third batch with additional boats at some point. We should be seeing clearance for the next batch coming in 2028-29, most likely.

Next, no one cancelled the third carrier. What has happened is that plans have been changed a bit. Originally, it was planned that Vikrant would be in service by 2018 or so, which would allow preliminary work on IAC-II (then planned to be the larger INS Vishal) to begin in the early 2020s, with a commissioning around 2035. With Vikramaditya planned to remain in service till 2043-45, this would give the Navy sufficient time with three carriers while IAC-III (most likely to be a sister to Vishal) entering service around the time Vikramaditya bowed out. However, Vikrant's delayed commissioning to 2022 combined with the fact that it was found that Vikramaditya would struggle to be in service past the mid-2030s meant that getting three carriers would either mean building two new carriers simultaneously, or giving Vikramaditya a prohibitively expensive modernisation and rebuild.

The delay in Vikrant combined with the fact that stuff like EMALS (which was originally proposed to be sourced from the US for Vishal) being ridiculously expensive also meant there were plans to delay Vishal a bit and get her more indigenous systems such as our own electromagnetic catapults, and possibly even nuclear propulsion (with the reactors being based on the 190 MW reactors in the works for the P-77 SSNs and S5-class SSBNs).

The revised assessment of Vikramaditya's condition, combined with the idea of getting a better carrier later on, meant that the Navy ran the risk of actually ending up in a scenario where Vikramaditya would leave service with a new carrier still not in service, which would leave us with just one carrier. This obviously wouldn't work, and so the Navy decided to take the most reasonable course of action: Get an upgraded sister ship to Vikrant to keep two carriers, and get a third upgraded carrier (IAC-III) later on. Ideally, IAC-III would replace Vikramaditya, but if push came to shove, IAC-II would fill that role instead.

The present plan therefore is for IAC-II to enter service in the mid-2030s, right around the tike Vikramaditya would be at the end of her lifespan. Subsequently, the larger and more technologically advanced IAC-III would enter service in the late 2040s, giving India a three-carrier force. A second ship of the same design in form of IAC-IV could then replace Vikrant in the late 2050s or early 2060s.

So, no. The three-carrier plan has not been cancelled. It has only been pushed back from the late 2030s to the late 2040s.
 
Um, not going to comment in the Rafales. However, your point about the SSNs and the carrier isn't entirely correct. Hear me out here.

Looking at how the Arihant-class was built, it was expected by many that the SSN program would be split into 3+3 or something similar, with boats being built in two batches. As things stand, that is the plan, with the first batch planned to have 2 ships, with a further 4 following in the second batch. Heck, we might end up having an upgraded class or a third batch with additional boats at some point. We should be seeing clearance for the next batch coming in 2028-29, most likely.

Next, no one cancelled the third carrier. What has happened is that plans have been changed a bit. Originally, it was planned that Vikrant would be in service by 2018 or so, which would allow preliminary work on IAC-II (then planned to be the larger INS Vishal) to begin in the early 2020s, with a commissioning around 2035. With Vikramaditya planned to remain in service till 2043-45, this would give the Navy sufficient time with three carriers while IAC-III (most likely to be a sister to Vishal) entering service around the time Vikramaditya bowed out. However, Vikrant's delayed commissioning to 2022 combined with the fact that it was found that Vikramaditya would struggle to be in service past the mid-2030s meant that getting three carriers would either mean building two new carriers simultaneously, or giving Vikramaditya a prohibitively expensive modernisation and rebuild.

The delay in Vikrant combined with the fact that stuff like EMALS (which was originally proposed to be sourced from the US for Vishal) being ridiculously expensive also meant there were plans to delay Vishal a bit and get her more indigenous systems such as our own electromagnetic catapults, and possibly even nuclear propulsion (with the reactors being based on the 190 MW reactors in the works for the P-77 SSNs and S5-class SSBNs).

The revised assessment of Vikramaditya's condition, combined with the idea of getting a better carrier later on, meant that the Navy ran the risk of actually ending up in a scenario where Vikramaditya would leave service with a new carrier still not in service, which would leave us with just one carrier. This obviously wouldn't work, and so the Navy decided to take the most reasonable course of action: Get an upgraded sister ship to Vikrant to keep two carriers, and get a third upgraded carrier (IAC-III) later on. Ideally, IAC-III would replace Vikramaditya, but if push came to shove, IAC-II would fill that role instead.

The present plan therefore is for IAC-II to enter service in the mid-2030s, right around the tike Vikramaditya would be at the end of her lifespan. Subsequently, the larger and more technologically advanced IAC-III would enter service in the late 2040s, giving India a three-carrier force. A second ship of the same design in form of IAC-IV could then replace Vikrant in the late 2050s or early 2060s.

So, no. The three-carrier plan has not been cancelled. It has only been pushed back from the late 2030s to the late 2040s.
As for the SSNs, simultaneous clearance could speed up things; we need them in double digits anyway. Our Navy is full throttle on indigenous platforms, but short of both quantity and firepower per unit, so speeding up is important.

As for the carriers, plans haven't changed but are delayed due to uncertainty, mainly due to "funding issues." Without these on time, we may lose our superiority in IOR as well. (Btw, a small-scale EMALS is being tested by R&DE(E) under DRDO.)
 
What about Su57?
No one wants that plane buddy. IAF literally ditched FGFA (which is basically Su57 but twin seater) and went for MRFA in 2018. This despite investing 300 million USD in it. Russia itself cancelled 70% orders and went for more Su35 - and that was years before the Ukraine war buddy.

In fact, lets assume for a second that we go for Su57. What will be it's main job? To counter J20 and J35, that is, Chinese stealth planes.

Now remember, China actually was offered Su57 and it rejected it, saying J20 is far superior. They even refused to buy a few units for reverse engineering or to study the plane. That's the kind of superiority J20 had over Su57, at least as per China.

And lets assume again that Su57 is indeed equivalent or superior to J20/J35. Now, the way stealth works is that there are certain angles, frequencies etc. at which the plane is exposed. That's why US doesn't want S400 near F35, or why China uses radar deflectors when using them for training purposes near LAC. But China has full access to Su57. It can literally take it to a lab and rip it apart and do whatever it wants to with that plane. So Su57's stealth, if there is any, will be literally shredded to pieces. So it offers us no advantage to us at all. And that is assuming IAF, Russian Air Force and PLAAF all are wrong and the plane is indeed decent enough.

That is why IAD doesn't want the plane under any circumstances. It is gonna be a massive liability for us.
 
Stop wasting Tax payers money in a 4th gen Jet who's complete induction(114 no.) would go beyond 2045.
Better buy a 5th Gen Jet with that money which can serve beyond 2070 as Rafales will get obsolete beyond 2050 with advanced 6th Gen jets.
Beyond 2045? Even assuming deal in 2027 as the article says, and first India made plane in 2032, we will get all 114 units in 2037-2038, if we assume a rate of production of 16 units per year (and first 14 delivered off the shelf).

And while fifth gen planes are great, 4th gen jets ain't going anywhere well beyond 2050. Even China is inducting 1 fifth gen plane today for every 4 fourth gen planes. Pak is mostly inducting 4th gen planes. It may have 1 fifth gen plane out of 10 active planes. And we can't make 4th gen planes either thanks to ADA and HAL. So buying 4th gen planes is a numerical requirement. Fifth gen planes, if available, can be an add on.
 
US is funding Bangladesh against India. Pumping proxies against all countries. And keep on changing conditions. What happens if we purchase and then if US comes with a condition of 100% tariff on all weapons to India? What about the delivery of engines for Tejas? Apache delivery is pending after 7 years. And what about the navy helicopters order which is still not delivered after 5 years? Ohhh, sorry, we can also have delivery of f35 with a delay of 50 years.
Bro, tariffs are imposed on imports, not exports. So tariffs will be on weapons from India, if at all.

As for Apaches, the deal was signed in 2020, so not sure how that makes it 7 years. And the delay is of about 18 months, mostly due to Covid.

As for F404, bro, HAL hadn't even delivered the trainer jets, for which engines had been delivered in 2020, till December 2024 at least. And now GE has supplied the engines, or at least started the delivery. So there is literally 0 delay on account of GE engines (though the engines were delayed, plane wasn't delayed due to them).

And coming to Naval Romeo helicopters, the delay is of less than a year. They were always expected to be completed in mid 2025. That has just been pushed back to the second half of 2025 as of now. So the delay is in fact of less than 6 months.

So yes, there are delays, no one is refuting that. But the delays are not so big that one can claim a systematic entrenchment of bias or a well planned conspiracy.
 
In this era of 5th-gen jets, going for 4.5-gen jets is useless.
Far from useless, bro, far from that. Remember, China is making one fifth-gen plane and four fourth-gen planes even now. Pakistan, even if it inducts J-35, will have only about 10% of its force as fifth-gen. Maybe 20% at best by 2040. So fourth-gen planes will still form the bulk.
 
The purchase of two squadrons of F-35 is very important for morale. At the moment, Pakistan with third-rate Chinese fighters are publicizing their acquisition and calling it 10-15 years of superiority. That confidence has to be blown away if F-35 is acquired. Later, AMCA will be available in 5-7 years.
 
Stop wasting Tax payers money in a 4th gen Jet who's complete induction(114 no.) would go beyond 2045.
Better buy a 5th Gen Jet with that money which can serve beyond 2070 as Rafales will get obsolete beyond 2050 with advanced 6th Gen jets.
IAF needs quantity also. SU-57 is untested, F-35 too costly, endangering the AMCA. You mean your suggestion is to buy from Chinese J-20 or are you going to produce a 5th-gen plane?
 

Forum statistics

Threads
4,595
Messages
49,295
Members
3,087
Latest member
Ash
Back
Top