Can Russia's Su-75 Convince India After 26-Ton MTOW and AL-51FI Engine Upgrade? AMCA Still Holds Homegrown Advantage

Russia is making a renewed push for its fifth-generation stealth fighter, the Su-75 "Checkmate," hoping to attract international customers, particularly India.

Recent updates to the aircraft, including an increased maximum takeoff weight (MTOW) of 26 tons and a planned upgrade to the AL-51FI engine, aim to make it a more competitive offering.

However, despite these improvements, the Su-75 faces an uphill battle in the Indian market, where the indigenously developed Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA) is gaining momentum.

Both the Su-75 and AMCA now boast a 26-ton MTOW, placing them in the same weight class and suggesting comparable performance potential. However, the AMCA program has a significant head start.

With prototypes expected within the next few years, the AMCA is far closer to realization than the Su-75, which remains a conceptual design with no flying prototype. This developmental gap is a crucial factor for India, which seeks a readily available solution to its urgent fighter modernization needs.

The Su-75's planned engine upgrade to the AL-51FI, while promising enhanced performance and stealth capabilities, is another area where the AMCA appears to have an edge.

While details about the AL-51FI remain scarce, the AMCA program is actively exploring collaborations with established engine manufacturers like General Electric, lending greater credibility to its propulsion plans.

Russia has expressed keen interest in exporting the Su-75 to India, but the aircraft's lack of a tangible prototype and flight test data has made Indian defence circles hesitant. The Indian Air Force (IAF) prioritizes platforms that are either in production or nearing production readiness, making the Su-75's conceptual stage a major obstacle.

Furthermore, the AMCA program aligns with India's "Make in India" initiative, emphasizing self-reliance in defence production. The Su-75, as a foreign design, may struggle to meet this requirement. India's focus on indigenous development and the AMCA's progress reduce the likelihood of the IAF opting for an untested foreign fighter jet.

Despite these challenges, Russia is expected to showcase the Su-75's updated design and program advancements at Aero India 2025, hoping to address India's concerns. However, with no flying prototype to demonstrate, the Su-75 may struggle to compete against other fully developed and near-production-ready fighter jets that are likely to be present at the event.

The Indian fighter market is becoming increasingly competitive, with established players like Lockheed Martin and Dassault also vying for a share. The Su-75, while technologically advanced on paper, faces stiff competition from both indigenous programs and established foreign offerings. Whether it can overcome these challenges and convince India remains to be seen.

 

[R. Singh]

Let us make SU-57 in India at Nasik plant and full spare parts with 100% TOT in a joint venture with Russian firm !

 

[P2S2]

Let us make SU-57 in India at Nasik plant and full spare parts with 100% TOT in a joint venture with Russian firm !

It would be prudent not to interfere with this development. Leaving it to develop independently would create superior science. Matter

 

[Vinayk]

Can anyone tell me why we are not considering joint development of engines for AMCA with Russia?

 

[Vivek M. R]

Can anyone tell me why we are not considering joint development of engines for AMCA with Russia?

As per the feedback through various YouTube channels and some podcasts. Russian engines are not superior compared to their western counterparts both from routine matainence, fuel consumption and total life. Moreover they are not stealthy either.Indians had opted for GE404 for Tejas as Russian engines were not suitable for Indian fighter planes, same is the case with Tejas mk2 and AMCA (in future) As after burner thrust is less in case of snecma m88 - 2 and their proposed m88-3 /4 have not been used. RR EJ 200 is not certified for single engine fighter jet. Hope we will get GE 414 with 80% TOT and followed by 120kn engine from one of the 3 manufacturers. RR, Snecma, GE.

 

[sanket]

IAF is fully backing and supporting indigenous fighter jet projects from Tejas MK1A, Tejas MK2, TEDBF & AMCA. Only interest in foreign fighter jets is under MRFA. Second, as per the engine for AMCA, there are 3 foreign partners, and one is yet to be selected, and it is not GE as mentioned in the article.

 

[abhinav srivastava]

Su75 is just a concept. It's prototype also doesn't exist. India should go for limited no of SU57s with India specific changes.

 

[PKPRS]

We need to be realistic about AMCA, it is still 15 years away minimum, also SU-75 and AMCA are not competing, they are totally different weight class, SU-75 will be ready in a year or two at the most, before even MK2 rolls out, the latest wing design looks totally different from what was showed three years ago like in the picture here, SU-75 wings now look exactly like SU-57 that increased the stealth, payload and fuel storage and Range, AL-51 engine is already fitted in SU-57M’s recently delivered to Russian Air Force, most likely India won’t buy MRFA jets until IAF pilots get hands on experience with these.

 

[PKPRS]

IAF is fully backing and supporting indigenous fighter jet projects from Tejas MK1A, Tejas MK2, TEDBF & AMCA. Only interest in foreign fighter jets is under MRFA. Second, as per the engine for AMCA, there are 3 foreign partners, and one is yet to be selected, and it is not GE as mentioned in the article.

But Tejas MK2 is a 4th gen jet like Rafale, India needs 5th gen jet to face off against Pakistan’s FC31/KHAAN and Chinese J20/J31 5th gen jets, we don’t to loose Indian Pilots valuable life along with $350Mln 4th gen Rafale.

 

[sanket]

But Tejas MK2 is a 4th gen jet like Rafale, India needs 5th gen jet to face off against Pakistan’s FC31/KHAAN and Chinese J20/J31 5th gen jets, we don’t to loose Indian Pilots valuable life along with $350Mln 4th gen Rafale.

Su-57 is option by the time AMCA goes to production with 3 sqad of Su-57 with customised it will b Handy

 

[Muthukumar Ponnambalam]

Unless and until PM directly involves and monitors - or at least gives strict instruction to the MoD to keep him updated about the progress promised - I'm sure those "concrete timelines and development goals" set by HAL & DRDO are meant only to be slipped. They'll have the same lame excuses every time "oh global supply chain challenges or this or that"

TIME FOR PMO TO GET THESE COMPANIES UNDER ITS WINGS.

 

[PKPRS]

Su-57 is option by the time AMCA goes to production with 3 sqad of Su-57 with customised it will b Handy

Instead of MRFA we could make SU-75 also, they will be a lot cheaper than SU-57.

 

[मित्र]

It's useless to say India will be interested in SU-75 if it's in the same class with AMCA. We better get 3-4 squadrons of SU-57 with local production of AL-51.

 

[Instant Karma]

SU-75 will eventually use many made in India part's. Russian have to source them from India.

 

[NSR]

Beware, Checkmate SU-75 is a paper plane and Russia is looking for a s ucker to fund its developments.

India must keep going at WARP SPEED with all of the developments and productions of TejasIAs, Tejas Mk IIs, TEDBF and AMCA Mk Is.
Lest not forget indigenous development of Indian derivatives of Kaveri fighter engine to equip at least Tejas IAs.

There is no other alternative to it.

 

[subash]

It is high time to ditch kaveri engine start new joint development plan.kaveri can be used for training new private team.

 

[Ronin]

IAF is fully backing and supporting indigenous fighter jet projects from Tejas MK1A, Tejas MK2, TEDBF & AMCA. Only interest in foreign fighter jets is under MRFA. Second, as per the engine for AMCA, there are 3 foreign partners, and one is yet to be selected, and it is not GE as mentioned in the article.

Just make 114 SU-57 and scrape MRFA, make 200-300 Tejas MK2, no need of buying 4th gen jets for MRFA, it won’t affect AMCA, AMCA can come out at 2045 or 2050 or whenever, we don’t need to be in a hurry.

 

[Kira]

Since the Su-57 failed to win over the IAF, it's very unlikely the less advanced Su-75 will manage to change their opinions.

 

[Varaaah]

Stick with Indian made planes. It is madness to acquire new foreign planes if you want develop your own aviation industry. Either the foreigners sell the critical technology or they don't. If they do not, then triple your efforts and attract foreign scientists who have experience in that field.

 

[PKPRS]

It's useless to say India will be interested in SU-75 if it's in the same class with AMCA. We better get 3-4 squadrons of SU-57 with local production of AL-51.

We could use AL-51 in both TEDBF and AMCA.

 

[PKPRS]

SU-75 will eventually use many made in India part's. Russian have to source them from India.

In our variant may be, wish we had that many India made parts, otherwise we won’t be making only 50% of 4th gen Tejas, other 50% we are still importing.

 

[PKPRS]

Since the Su-57 failed to win over the IAF, it's very unlikely the less advanced Su-75 will manage to change their opinions.

Nothing failed yet, only the collaboration project failed.

 

[Haroon]

Everything is good. But let's be practical, unless GE provides us with the engines, there is no Tejas MK1A and MK2. Moreover, MK2 is still on paper, and for AMCA, we have yet to select an engine partner, and it is still on paper. When you develop a fifth-generation fighter jet, we may come across numerous hindrances because it is a complex piece of machinery. It can take more time, so we have to find solutions ASAP to address our squadron strength. In case India is not interested in Su-75, it is okay, but we may go with an alternate plan like getting the AL-51-F1 engine for MK2. So, MRFA is delayed a long time now; we need it in 6 years. Within 3 years, the selected vendor has to build a company with complex manufacturing systems and TOT to a local partner, which is nearly impossible. So what is the next step?

 

[vasu gali]

Better to buy SU 57, a 5th generation plane with full TOT and AL 51 engines and customized for IAF, rather than the very costly but only 4.5 generation Rafael with delivery expected around 2030. Also, the AL 51 engines could prove useful for AMCA/TEJAS MK2 as the GE 404/414 blackmailing is detrimental to IAF.

 

[MKR]

Waiting for GE engine will be an eternal wait. The US under no circumstances will give us more than 3-4 engines in a year ..they will see to it that we are kept in need of fighters always so that we import. Defence ministry officials have been bought over to see that the GE Order in not cancelled and we do not go for the Rolls Royce or Russian Turbofan series or improved engines