India Needs to Fast-Track Kaveri Engine and Adapt for Next Tejas Mk1A Order Amidst GE F404 Engine Delay, Says Defence Expert

A leading defence expert has called upon the Indian Ministry of Defence (MoD) to accelerate the development of the indigenous Kaveri engine, suggesting its integration into future Tejas Mk1A fighter jets.

This call to action comes in light of ongoing delays in the supply of F404 engines from GE Aerospace, highlighting India's vulnerability to disruptions in the global supply chain.

The expert emphasized the urgent need for a reliable domestic engine solution to avoid setbacks in India's ambitious Tejas program. While the Kaveri engine, in its current "dry" configuration, produces around 49kN of thrust, it is believed that with the addition of an afterburner, it could achieve "wet" thrust comparable to the GE F404.

Calculations suggest that an afterburner-equipped Kaveri engine could generate approximately 83.3 kN of thrust. Although slightly lower than the F404's 84 kN, the Kaveri's "flat-rated" design, optimized for high-temperature and high-altitude conditions prevalent in India, could compensate for this difference. This design ensures consistent thrust levels even in challenging environments, a feature not always present in foreign-made engines.

The recent delay in F404 engine deliveries underscores the risks associated with relying on foreign suppliers for critical military technologies. The expert argues that India's dependence on imported engines leaves its defence programs susceptible to potential disruptions, especially in the face of global uncertainties. A fully operational Kaveri engine would not only ensure a steady supply of engines for the growing Tejas fleet but also provide India with a strategic advantage.

To achieve this goal, the expert urges the MoD to commit to increased funding and support for the Kaveri engine program. With adequate resources, it is estimated that the Kaveri could be ready to power the Tejas Mk1A within the next five years. Furthermore, a successful Kaveri engine would lay the foundation for future indigenous fighter programs, providing a proven and reliable engine solution.

This call for self-reliance in aero-engine technology reflects a growing sentiment within India's defence community. As India strives to strengthen its defence capabilities, the development of a robust domestic engine industry is seen as a crucial step towards achieving strategic autonomy.

 

[R. Singh]

If GTRE and Safran could crack 90KN thrust engine nothing like that ! France and India should also develop 110 KN engine for Tejas-AF-II and Made in India Rafale fighters ! We need super cruise capable Mac-2.35 speed variant of Rafale !

 

[RajeshN]

Why govt of india publicly clear their position on kaveri development programme

 

[P2S2]

Additional to supporting Indian engine manufacturers MoD should think ahead by positioning Indian technology in supporting secondary manufacturing in Australia. Not only for safety but by becoming a dual indigenous supplier thereby ensuring additional support in joint upgrades. End of the day its the numbers produced that determine its costs and viability. With Australia, Japan and Indonesia India can strengthen its position in supplying ASEAN nations. National interests in strengthening defense production should occupy an equal position as that of defence itself. Proactive support policies are needed.

 

[subrat beura]

We should take help of Safran to merge Kaveri with M-88 core obtain 90KN thrust.Next do R&D for 110KN

 

[SASIDHARAN Nair]

Why can't MoD rope in the ISRO & DRDO IN THIS ?? ISRO is a pioneer in Rocket engine & I think they can help HAL .

 

[linus52]

Hope there are more then dongle Kaveri prototype engines built & if this the case then one of these should be mounted on fighter jet and tested simple.

 

[Radium]

The GE F404 was developed in the 1970s, and India has not even produced engines from half a century ago.

 

[sanket]

Kaveri will take time to fine-tune, test certification, etc. ... maybe almost a decade. The fine-tuning of Kaveri is already on. Brahmos Aerospace is already tasked to develop lightweight material which withstands high temperatures. This analyst should tell about an immediate solution for the GE-404 engine instead of the long term, which is already on & GTRE is doing a good thing by fine-tuning the Kaveri to become Atmanirbhar in jet engines.

 

[abhinav srivastava]

It matches RD33 thrust levels. With some weight reduction, it should be tested on mig 29s.

 

[Anant]

The more common wet thrust to dry thrust ratio is around 1.6, so a 49 kN dry thrust Kaveri can manage just shy of 80 kN wet thrust. Going from that 80 to 84 kN is where the engine will need upgrades. Increasing the wet thrust to dry thrust ratio is definitely possible, but doing so usually leads to a shortage in engine life.

 

[coke]

The more common wet thrust to dry thrust ratio is around 1.6, so a 49 kN dry thrust Kaveri can manage just shy of 80 kN wet thrust. Going from that 80 to 84 kN is where the engine will need upgrades. Increasing the wet thrust to dry thrust ratio is definitely possible, but doing so usually leads to a shortage in engine life.

Kaveri dry variant achieved 51kn instead of 49 in recent tests in russia

 

[Anant]

Kaveri dry variant achieved 51kn instead of 49 in recent tests in russia

51 kN may be the maximum, but is it the maximum sustained thrust, since those may vary a bit?

Regardless, even if one runs with 51 kN, that comes to about 80.5 kN, which is still a bit short than 84 kN or higher.

 

[Ravi Krishna Iyengar]

Combat engine development is a very intricate, strenuous and complicated task. GTRE is the single point of source appointed by the GoI. Enough money has been spent on OEMs like SAFRAN who only wanted to build their coffers. Excellent propulsion engineers have retired from GTRE without much glory. IAF has a permanent post of Gp Capt at GTRE for the last 20 years without any serious contribution. IAF permanently seconded an Officer who also picked up Air Marshal rank over 25 years and retired without much contribution. We are stuck at the K-10 version of Kaveri and the FTB results from Russia. This list thread has to be regained with a core team from GTRE , IAF, Academia, Industry and headed by a senior MoD Secy level officer with a Steering Cmte at the RM level for next 5 years. Otherwise this programme will not see the light of Day.

 

[AA AAP]

Fast track is great idea

How to do that ?

 

[AA AAP]

Additional to supporting Indian engine manufacturers MoD should think ahead by positioning Indian technology in supporting secondary manufacturing in Australia. Not only for safety but by becoming a dual indigenous supplier thereby ensuring additional support in joint upgrades. End of the day its the numbers produced that determine its costs and viability. With Australia, Japan and Indonesia India can strengthen its position in supplying ASEAN nations. National interests in strengthening defense production should occupy an equal position as that of defence itself. Proactive support policies are needed.

Sound great. This will meet great export success like the Tejas.

 

[sanket]

Kaveri dry variant achieved 51kn instead of 49 in recent tests in russia

It is possible to achieve 1.8 times the dry thrust. You are right, Kaveri dry thrust achieved 51 kN, but achieving sustained thrust is important. For that, lightweight material that can withstand higher temperatures is needed. I have said 100 times that Midhani, ISRO, GTRE, and Brahmos Aerospace should come together to develop such material.

 

[Akshat]

It matches RD33 thrust levels. With some weight reduction, it should be tested on mig 29s.

It can’t be tested on anything. DRDO appointed auditor declared that the whole hot core has to be changed before the engine can be flight tested.

 

[Manoj Kumar G]

Kaveri will take time to fine-tune, test certification, etc. ... maybe almost a decade. The fine-tuning of Kaveri is already on. Brahmos Aerospace is already tasked to develop lightweight material which withstands high temperatures. This analyst should tell about an immediate solution for the GE-404 engine instead of the long term, which is already on & GTRE is doing a good thing by fine-tuning the Kaveri to become Atmanirbhar in jet engines.

3.5 billion dollaars were thrown away for 35 Reaper drones. Cant they spend 1Billion Euros SAFRAn demanding for making 110KN engine & fix kaveri for us?

 

[Dr. Venkateswara Rao. Korasiga]

It is better to continue our Kaveri program further so that at any eventuality of SC disruption we can use them. Also we can export to other countries. Variants can be used for Naval applications and high power drones etc. Knowledge will be with us and further research to enhance the engine can be possible in future.

 

[Joydip 1978]

I fail to understand why not rope in all IITs & Tech Schools along with private players like TATA,Mahindra,Kalyani etc all together on a mission mode so that we can reach at least Chinese level if not US or Russian levels to built our own 5th & 6th Gen fighter jets in 10 years time and meanwhile we must now purchase foreign made 5th Gen fighter jets to meet up our squadron requirements so that Chinese & Pakistani threats can be taken care of.After all national security cannot be compromised at any costs.

 

[Akshat]

3.5 billion dollaars were thrown away for 35 Reaper drones. Cant they spend 1Billion Euros SAFRAn demanding for making 110KN engine & fix kaveri for us?

It was left to DRDO and unfortunately they decided not to do it.

 

[Sandeep]

If India wants to develop another jet comparable to the F404 then they can’t do it with the Kaveri engine.

The best option is to start and develop a brand new engine from the start with the private sector helping to reduce time and costs and provide the knowledge and experience who can also help with manufacturing it afterwards as well.

 

[PKPRS]

3.5 billion dollaars were thrown away for 35 Reaper drones. Cant they spend 1Billion Euros SAFRAn demanding for making 110KN engine & fix kaveri for us?

Whopping $10Bln thrown away to buy only 36 Rafales, can’t they invest $5Bln on Kaveri.