Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA) News and Discussion

[beencensured]

Simple. No chinese weapon anywhere in the world has worked as advertised. J-20 specially is not tested in any battle.

Let us not presume. They are successful in other fields like supercomputers and developing their own super chips. So, being successful in other areas should not be surprising.

 

[CCPSmasher]

Never had a long term vision but always the reactionist and chasing the enemy has the been story of this country. All these projects should have been cleared and protype must have been rolled out of the floor by now. Oh well

 

[beencensured]

Government has unnecessarily wasted a lot of time in trying to find a private company to lead the AMCA programme. No need to do so any more. Instead government should form a consortium of companies consisting of HAL, BEL, BDL, BHEL and MIDHANI as partners in the AMCA program and HAL as the leading partner. Ultimately all these companies are going to supply the majority of the subsystems of the AMCA program.

DRDO, NAL, ADA as the development partners and Boeing or lockdown Martin can be roped in as the foreign advisors.

Boeing and ?Lockdown? will not help unless you are buying their products, but then quality goes down as too many diverse systems to integrate. Why would a nuclear power allow a foreign country to tinker with its stealth. It seems irrational at best as they will pass all information to Pakistan like with Scorpene submarine leaks.

 

[shivkumar sinha]

Let us not presume. They are successful in other fields like supercomputers and developing their own super chips. So, being successful in other areas should not be surprising.

Chinese are trying to match western technology in nano chips and jet engine but are still a few generations behind. Now they can't steal easily from western labs and research centres as they could a few years ago .

 

[beencensured]

AMCA development is going to be super expensive. The govt wants to reduce costs somewhat by inviting private players who can make up the cost by getting future govt aerospace contracts. It will also lead to increased competition in aerospace sector in india. Win Win. Maybe other strat is required since it is not working till now.

I would not say super expensive. but for the amount about 2 billion dollars.

 

[Sanatani Yodha]

What pressure???
Hen china was building hundreds of 4+ gen Su27 and Su30 copies; J10c (Lavi copies) in year 2010-2020, what Indian Govt/ MoD/ HAL/ ADA/ DRDO doing??? They didn’t able to build 50 nos Tejas between 2005-2024……..
Now talking about AMCA!!! Its a joke…. Our apparatus simply can’t bulk manufacture with quality….

 

[Superpower Bharat]

Even US with almost 3 times of budget of China can't even has 200 F-22 then how China can maintain more than 250 j-20.. this is a question...it means it's a cheap copy of Russian jet...not truly fith gen aircraft...

 

[desigandu]

Key to Tejas-Mk2, AMCA-Mk-1, and Mk-2 long term will be the high thrust domestic engine (120-130KN) being developed with safran...If the JV can start producing this engine (post testing and certification) before 2035, then all AMCA's (especially Mk-2s) can have this engine and thus supercruise and the cooling to increase full spectrum stealth...India should also start thinking about 6th gen (at least start a project to plan) either by joining the GCAP (UK+Japan+Italy) or launch one domestically (formally by 2030) so we can field a fighter in the 2040-2045 timeframe, buth key again will be variable cycle engines (like the ones for NGAD) with high thrusts of 200KN...Long term Defense-Industrial roadmap, while transforming R&D via DRDO, Labs, private players and an innovation ecosystem is vital.

 

[Apocalypse gupta]

Key to Tejas-Mk2, AMCA-Mk-1, and Mk-2 long term will be the high thrust domestic engine (120-130KN) being developed with safran...If the JV can start producing this engine (post testing and certification) before 2035, then all AMCA's (especially Mk-2s) can have this engine and thus supercruise and the cooling to increase full spectrum stealth...India should also start thinking about 6th gen (at least start a project to plan) either by joining the GCAP (UK+Japan+Italy) or launch one domestically (formally by 2030) so we can field a fighter in the 2040-2045 timeframe, buth key again will be variable cycle engines (like the ones for NGAD) with high thrusts of 200KN...Long term Defense-Industrial roadmap, while transforming R&D via DRDO, Labs, private players and an innovation ecosystem is vital.

amca mk-2 will already be a 6th gen fighter. There is really no clarity on difference between 5th gen and 6th gen. Most experts agree that the difference is basically a quantitative one rather than a qualitative one. Basically- better stealth, better avionics, computing power, load carring capacity, range etc.

 

[Pink Panther]

So Su-30 MKI may have GaA AESA Radar , while AMCA is going to have GaN based AESA Radar., so Most of the Tech and weapons will b developed while Flight Testing Tejas MK2 so AMCA MK1 can Meet Time line . Crucial thing will b Developing Aero-Engine for AMCA MK2 with 110kN to 120kN before 2034. .

In 20 years when AMCA prototype will be made, LRDE will develop GaN radar, it is absolutely true, anything made for Tejas MK1A, MK2 and TEDBF/ORCA will be used in AMCA, hope and pray that MK2 and TEDBF/ORCA are made fast relevant to the time, otherwise GOI will be making AMCA when the the whole world will be flying 7th or 8th gen Aircraft.

 

[Apocalypse gupta]

I would not say super expensive. but for the amount about 2 billion dollars.

that is the initial funding round just for developing 5 prototypes. A lot of funding will be required in future as well.

 

[Mridul baruah]

Pehle bana lo.

 

[Bharat007]

Idealism is not important in battlefield or in struggle for supremacy acc. to. China. They only care about winning the race to be mightiest Nation in the world at any cost. What matter is who won and who lost the the race! There will be no second prize in future conflict.

India is facing this type of enemy!

 

[Bharat007]

According to legend, Lachit Borphukan assigned his uncle, the Ahom King, the task of preparing a makeshift defensive wall in a specific location overnight in anticipation of a Mughal attack the next morning. Lachit, taking on the responsibility of building another defensive wall, completed his task by midnight. When he visited his uncle's work, he found him dozed off with the task only half-finished. Despite Lachit's repeated pleas for him to wake up and complete the work, the Ahom King remained unresponsive. In a fit of rage, Lachit Borphukan drew his sword and fatally stabbed him for negligence of duty.

In the present, India seems to face a situation akin to the legend of Lachit Borphukan, where individuals responsible for strengthening the military may be metaphorically dozing off or waking up late. The urgency of bolstering defense measures is evident, with some key responsibilities left unattended. The call for action is comparable to Lachit's plea for his uncle to complete the defensive wall, emphasizing the need for timely and effective measures to counter China/Pak nexus.

 

[Rajesh]

Chinese j20 might not be a true 5th gen fighter jet comparing American ones but they will still be far better than our 4+jen fighter . With only 36 rafales and next century to be upgraded su-30 don't know how we will face china and their pimp lap dog Pakistan in terms of nos. We should have selected engine for amca already and fast tracked prototype development already by now. 100+ mmrca should have been finalised years back because it has been 10 years since upa is gone and yet the situation in defense is same . Don't know when the Tejas mk1a will come considering it ise hal which makes them .

 

[beencensured]

Key to Tejas-Mk2, AMCA-Mk-1, and Mk-2 long term will be the high thrust domestic engine (120-130KN) being developed with safran...If the JV can start producing this engine (post testing and certification) before 2035, then all AMCA's (especially Mk-2s) can have this engine and thus supercruise and the cooling to increase full spectrum stealth...India should also start thinking about 6th gen (at least start a project to plan) either by joining the GCAP (UK+Japan+Italy) or launch one domestically (formally by 2030) so we can field a fighter in the 2040-2045 timeframe, buth key again will be variable cycle engines (like the ones for NGAD) with high thrusts of 200KN...Long term Defense-Industrial roadmap, while transforming R&D via DRDO, Labs, private players and an innovation ecosystem is vital.

My thinking if they can fix the su-30mki engine then the same people can develop an better engine. Just learn to award talent, and drop hand holding.

 

[Amit Ray]

This is a kick in our back and I hope it wakes up our defence babus as well as the govt.

 

[Anurag]

In 20 years when AMCA prototype will be made, LRDE will develop GaN radar, it is absolutely true, anything made for Tejas MK1A, MK2 and TEDBF/ORCA will be used in AMCA, hope and pray that MK2 and TEDBF/ORCA are made fast relevant to the time, otherwise GOI will be making AMCA when the the whole world will be flying 7th or 8th gen Aircraft.

Well once you have to develop the niche technology without the support you really can't just predict the exact timeline,
Amca project according to news kick start almost 1.5 decade ago but true reality is Amca was just an copy version of FGFA. Sudden IAF decide it is not satisfied with the FGFA program so without any further tech it just turn within & as I believe Tejas program helped a lot to build the confidence that we can achieve it. In this means time we didn't even get the technologies from the MRFA(no one knows when this deal will be concluded) so developing things take time, I just hope that around 2030 we will se Tejas mk2 & Amca prototype flying it will be too good if three prototype flying in the air with tedbf. It's not going to be an easy journey but showing frustration & saying bad things will not make it better.

 

[Anurag]

AMCA development is going to be super expensive. The govt wants to reduce costs somewhat by inviting private players who can make up the cost by getting future govt aerospace contracts. It will also lead to increased competition in aerospace sector in india. Win Win. Maybe other strat is required since it is not working till now.

How it's super expensive???? You are developing a fifth generation fighter aircraft with the initial funding of under 2 billion, I will say it may be world's least expensive fifth generation fighter aircraft that we are making!! Saying anything about indigenous program people just forget that it's a fifth generation fighter a niche tech that few nation only holds.

 

[Bhupesh Desai]

2034 Foreign partner for AMCA Engine may b selected after Election so within 10 years Engine has to Ready to Integrate in AMCA MK2 Initial batches of AMCAMK1 May have GE-414 98kN Engine.

GE-414 98kN Engine is not capable to power AMCA MK1; need at least 100kN engine for MK1.

 

[Sudha]

We need to have jets for our carriers, without jets, carriers are basically super expensive targets

With jets also they are super expensive targets. All one needs is a missile to sink an AC.

 

[The_rED_dEVIL]

MRFA should b Fast Track . if current Govt Retains to Power then all defence project will b fast Tracked Deal for 26 Rafale Marine is Pending. with CCS Clearance For AMCA second part will b Engine partner slection and developing that Engine within 10 years.

F414 engine production should have started by this year... F404 production rate increment is very important as well.

 

[Apocalypse gupta]

With jets also they are super expensive targets. All one needs is a missile to sink an AC.

an AC surrounded by a battlegroup, consisting of multiple destroyers, frigates, ASW corvettes, awacs helicopters, submarines. And it is always moving at a pretty good speed. Dude, good luck if you think you can sink a 50,000 ton AC in between all of that, using 1 missile. If that missile is a brahmastra or something sudarshan chakra, then maybe it will be possible.

 

[Apocalypse gupta]

How it's super expensive???? You are developing a fifth generation fighter aircraft with the initial funding of under 2 billion, I will say it may be world's least expensive fifth generation fighter aircraft that we are making!! Saying anything about indigenous program people just forget that it's a fifth generation fighter a niche tech that few nation only holds.

i also think that when compared to other countries it will be cheap, but from Indian standards, it will be our most expensive project, even more expensive than our aircraft carrier.

 

[charminar_waale_ismail_bhai]

150 J-20A in 2023 to 250 J-20A as of today.

100 Fifth Generation fighters added in 1 year.

I am sure, HAL must be eyeing this.

If they have some shame left, probably we will get to see 3 Tejas Mk1A roll out this year.

 

[charminar_waale_ismail_bhai]

Boeing or lockdown Martin can be roped in as the foreign advisors.

+1000 for lockdown Martin

 

[Tanishq Bafila]

MRFA should b Fast Track . if current Govt Retains to Power then all defence project will b fast Tracked Deal for 26 Rafale Marine is Pending. with CCS Clearance For AMCA second part will b Engine partner slection and developing that Engine within 10 years.

In the current budget money has already been sanctioned for 26 Rafale Marine

 

[Blue Whale]

In 20 years when AMCA prototype will be made, LRDE will develop GaN radar, it is absolutely true, anything made for Tejas MK1A, MK2 and TEDBF/ORCA will be used in AMCA, hope and pray that MK2 and TEDBF/ORCA are made fast relevant to the time, otherwise GOI will be making AMCA when the the whole world will be flying 7th or 8th gen Aircraft.

You Sir, pure and simple, are an idiot!

 

[Tanishq Bafila]

What pressure???
Hen china was building hundreds of 4+ gen Su27 and Su30 copies; J10c (Lavi copies) in year 2010-2020, what Indian Govt/ MoD/ HAL/ ADA/ DRDO doing??? They didn’t able to build 50 nos Tejas between 2005-2024……..
Now talking about AMCA!!! Its a joke…. Our apparatus simply can’t bulk manufacture with quality….

U can't compare China & India in last decade , it would be unfair.

Compare this decade china vs India , as india DPSUs , private sectors are getting matured & GOI supporting projects.

There are reports that the newly bought foreign drone , that has capability to fly for 52 hours under best conditions is flying for 17 hours in Indian conditions and ALL 3 armed forces are now thinking about decreasing the MALE requirements... Which has already shown excellent results to fly 17 hours in india conditions

 

[Sunnyj]

an AC surrounded by a battlegroup, consisting of multiple destroyers, frigates, ASW corvettes, awacs helicopters, submarines. And it is always moving at a pretty good speed. Dude, good luck if you think you can sink a 50,000 ton AC in between all of that, using 1 missile. If that missile is a brahmastra or something sudarshan chakra, then maybe it will be possible.

And yet Gotland class, French sub for Portuguese navy, German 212 sub got fix for US carriers in exercises even after all the carrier escorts.Don’t underestimate quite diesel electric subs.